SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

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SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby charlieBrown » Mon Feb 10, 2014 8:39 pm

Has anyone else had problems when fitting SIP tubeless rims with the dome nuts stripping the wheel studs?
I have stripped two on my front hub and now need to replace them and also what is the proper method for removing the damaged studs, is it just a case of using mole grips and winding them out from the front (wheel) side, winding the opposite way as it is a reverse thread?
any advice at all greatly appreciated :?
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby glscoot » Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:47 pm

If you check at the back of the hub on the stud, there is usually an Allen key slot so you can remove the stud.
If you contact SIP about this problem they will send you a full set of replacement studs, this is a common fault with the SIP tubeless rims, apparently it's been rectified.
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby charlieBrown » Mon Feb 10, 2014 9:52 pm

Cheers Scoot, but on the back of the studs it looks like it has just a round hole with no allen fitting.
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby glscoot » Mon Feb 10, 2014 10:48 pm

Give it a clean with a wire brush or similar. It could be covered in paint, it is the proper way to remove them, I would also spray a little WD40 or similar before you attempt to remove the stud.
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby Laurie » Mon Feb 10, 2014 10:54 pm

I would stick with good old fashioned spitters!

Haven't had too many probs over 27 years.

Fix by the side of the road too!
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby charlieBrown » Mon Feb 10, 2014 10:58 pm

will check again in the morning but it is a brand new scoot and the hub hasn't been painted over, the hole on the back of the stud just looks round, same on all of the studs, not like the ones on my Px they have allen fittings on the back.
maybe get a new hub and be a bit more careful this time, although I was extra cautious when fitting these nuts, they just don't seem right somehow, maybe fit flange nuts if I can get right ones for the job.
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby glscoot » Mon Feb 10, 2014 11:38 pm

Its not your fault, its SIP's, they have admitted it themselves and have offered new studs to anyone who bought the rims. It will happen to your new hub, the studs are not long enough. Contact them and they will send you longer hub studs free of charge.

I will need to check my hubs now, although Ive powdered my hubs so may be more difficult to see whats going on, all though I've not ventured down the tubeless rims yet. Will consider them when I get my project a bit further along. Its taking ages and costing a fortune.
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby tipper » Mon Feb 10, 2014 11:57 pm

The lml studs don't have the Allen heads,I'm not sure how you remove them as my tubeless rims went on without and issues.

Didn't sip update the nuts ? Mine arnt dome nuts and they came with nord lock washers.

Laurie,you can still carry a spare to change at the side of the road and tubeless rims are less likely to explode when something sticks in them :lol:
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby charlieBrown » Tue Feb 11, 2014 6:15 am

Your absolutely correct the studs do not seem to be long enough for the dome nuts that SIP use, they have never felt right when fitting and always seemed to be gripping and no more so seems that I will have to replace the studs anyway.
had a look and there is definitely no allen fitting on the rear of the stud.
My main problem is how do I get the old studs out to fit the new replacements :? that is assuming SIP send me the new studs, spoke to a Vespa PX owner and he said that he removed all of his studs and replaced them with a good quality bolt and flanged self locking nut and he has had no further issues with his tubeless rims, has anyone else gone down this route :?: :?
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby marty r » Tue Feb 11, 2014 9:18 am

If they're a r/h thread you could always try an Easy Out in a drill. but they're more likely to be l/h aren't they. Maybe cut a slot on the back of the stud and soak in WD.

Think you might need to get the hub off to make it easy though.
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby Old Wesley » Tue Feb 11, 2014 9:57 am

Replaced a lot of these studs over the years, the studs are screwed in ( right hand thread) the end of the stud is then riveted over,the shallow hole is there to make it easier to do this, Good quality studs will have a plain shank between the threaded ends so you can tighten them in before you rivet the backside over preventing the stud moving in or out when removing the wheel nuts, My method of removing them is to grind the backside flush, then drill a short distance down with an 8mm drill to remove the riveted area then lock two nuts to the other end and wind the stud out, Also a good idea to run an 8mm tap through the hole before fitting the new stud, A bit drawn out but hope this helps. WES.
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby charlieBrown » Tue Feb 11, 2014 12:52 pm

think that I will remove the hub and then remove the studs and replace with decent bolts and nuts, could save any future hassle :?
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby deekay » Tue Feb 11, 2014 8:48 pm

Like tipper I have Sip rims and have had no issue, mine are not dome nuts but a parallel nut?
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby Geezer » Wed Feb 12, 2014 7:15 am

Yeah I had it happen and so did my m8 both on the rear. The key is to keep the rear off the floor whilst fully tightening, if it's on the floor for that last little tweek it doesn't seem to pull in and the threads just strip.
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby charlieBrown » Wed Feb 12, 2014 8:21 am

so is there a definitive way to remove these studs? are they reverse threaded?
seems like it is best to grind the rear of the stud then remove using either mole grips or twin nuts.....any advice on this?
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby sharpcroft » Wed Feb 12, 2014 10:48 am

Im glad i saw this post, i struggled like hell to fit my rims as the studs are just a couple of mm too short so unless everything is perfectly aligned you cant get all the nuts on, i got there in the end but not sure i want to do it in the pishing rain in the dark, if the threads where a wee bit longer you could get all the nuts started and tightening them in an opposite to opposite pattern would line everything up until the rim was on tight, i've contacted the customer help line so now im waiting for a reply,

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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby charlieBrown » Wed Feb 12, 2014 12:51 pm

glscoot wrote:Its not your fault, its SIP's, they have admitted it themselves and have offered new studs to anyone who bought the rims. It will happen to your new hub, the studs are not long enough. Contact them and they will send you longer hub studs free of charge.

I will need to check my hubs now, although Ive powdered my hubs so may be more difficult to see whats going on, all though I've not ventured down the tubeless rims yet. Will consider them when I get my project a bit further along. Its taking ages and costing a fortune.


Here is the reply that I received from SIP today,

Hello Charlie!

Thank you very much for your email and your interest in SIP Scootershop.
We are very happy that you decided to contact us regarding your questions.

We will try to answer your request.

I´m so sorry but we never heard about this before.

We think there`s a quality problem with your studs.

How much of them are wrong on your scooter? Have you mounted one side already or you can`t fix them not on the front and also not on the rearside?

We hope that we could help you.

If you have any further technical question, please visit our bulletin board:
http://www.sip-scootershop.com/community/forums/

Here's news for all following this thread, contacted SIP and they asked me to send photo's of the problem and a description of the problem, this I did and received a reply this morning saying that SIP are unaware of this problem and have never had any reported problems like this before, they suggested that it is the quality of the hub studs that are at fault.
Have sent another email asking how they can help resolve this issue and I await a reply.
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby glscoot » Wed Feb 12, 2014 2:38 pm

Charlie
If that is the case, why do you have dome nuts and the rest
normal nuts. Cheap joke, did you explain that to SIP, I bet if you order a set of tubeless rims now you will not get dome nuts, I wonder why.

SIP is a great shop, but try getting a refund or a replacement part out of them, you'll struggle. Often ends up you forking out for return postage.
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby Geezer » Thu Feb 13, 2014 12:03 pm

charlieBrown wrote:so is there a definitive way to remove these studs? are they reverse threaded?
seems like it is best to grind the rear of the stud then remove using either mole grips or twin nuts.....any advice on this?


Standard thread all the way... I used pipe grips to wind mine back out the rear of the hub as they were splayed slightly on the rear. Then when fitting the new ones I used Locktite and also once fully in I used a centre pop around the edge of the stud where it was flush to the rear of the rim. This just splays the metal slightly to stop them unwinding on their own.

Oh, and I had the problem on a genuine P2 hub and not an LML one, so it's not like we can blame LML for not making the studs long enough.
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Re: SIP Tubless Rims Nuts Stripping Studs

Postby eaijm01 » Tue Mar 15, 2016 8:35 pm

On fitting these to my LML 200 4T found SIP wheel nuts with special locking washer only secured on wheel stud end threads by 2 ½ to 3 turns. Also found 2 not locking due to stripped thread. SIP recommends wheels are only fitted to good studs. Rather than buy a new hub and same problem I choose to try and modify mine.
No responsibility or liability accepted if you choose to try this yourself as there is a high degree of risk and safety involvement.
The existing LML wheels studs are only approx. 30 mm overall and not supposed to be replaced as LML only supply new hubs with wheel studs attached, although Vespa studs same size are available. Could have used some suitable 8M threaded bar and penned over if I removed hub, but choose to use some high tensile M8 35 mm allen head button bolts for rear hub and some modified M8 35 mm countersunk for front hub (clearance required to clear calliper) so they could easily be replaced if damaged in future
Front hub were left in situ on scooter, rear hub removed for inspection although can be done in situ.
To remove existing wheel studs its required to drill off the penned over head at rear carefully with suitable sized drill, its then easy using two M8 nuts on stud to wind out anti clock wise.
On the rear hub you can then from the rear screw in the new M8 35 mm button head bolt (can use a hex head as alt) use thread lock solution and tighten to hub.
Front hub used counter sunk allen head M8 35 mm high tensile bolts, I modified using a file with bolt rotating in drill. Reducing the head dia of the csk bolt to approx. 3/8”. To suit the width available on rear of hub that has been machined. Then carefully countersunk the rear of the hub wheel stud fixing hole to approx 2mm, the depth of raised section to allow the head of the bolt to fit neatly. Need to check and reduce/adjust further the head of bolt a little at a time, so that the hub rotates and bolt head does not hit and clears the brake callipers, use thread lock to secure into hub.
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