LML two year warranty

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LML two year warranty

Postby Quasi » Wed Apr 27, 2016 2:48 pm

Hi all. I recently (1st March) took delivery of a new LML 4T 200. Upon getting the scooter home and in my garage I noticed a number of paint faults that were not readily obvious at the dealers in bright sunlight reflecting off the bodywork. I took the scooter back a few days later to show the salesman the paint problems. His reply was amazing, I quote, " Its only an LML so what do you expect". My reply was thus, A product fit for purpose and of durable quality, especially if I choose to sell it on one day. The saleman said that his dealership does not cover paint work faults. I contacted MOTO GB who endorsed the dealer's utterances. So it begs the question what does the so called 2 year guarantee actually cover, it would seem very little other than mechanical failures. SO IF AN LML IS IN YOUR MIND AS THE SCOOTER YOU WANT, THEN BE AWARE OF THE PROS AND CONS.
I am getting estimates for paint resprays and I will get the bike right to my satisfaction. If LML want their scooters to be a global and trusted brand then best they start getting the bodies rightly inspected on the assembly lines. I am just glad LML don't make cars.
Quasi
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Location: Great Yarmouth area
Scooter: Lml 4t 200

Re: LML two year warranty

Postby rob h » Wed Apr 27, 2016 5:46 pm

Please seek advice before respraying. All motor dealers have to adhere to the strict legislation. An item purchased must be of merchantable quality. You entered into a sales contract for a new vehicle of perfect paint finish, otherwise the dealer would have had to inform you on sale that the item may have faults. I have found trading standards excellent, as condition of a new vehicle cannot be argued about in a Civil Court, i have seen cars returned to manufacturers with paint faults. I have personally had touch ups done on second hand cars, when I found damage not pointed out prior to purchase.
I personally think you have a strong case, you could get a free consultation with a solicitor and I bet they would snap your hand off no fee no win. Also check you insurance for legal protection and what it covers, and sometimes it can be in your house insurance. I have made applications to civil court a number of times, they have very low set fees paid up front. if you are in the right you win every time as the level of proof is much lower, and based on common sense. "On the balance of probabilities" is the legal expression. You obtain a court pack fill it in and register it, supplying your evidence, but hopefully trading standards will do it for you.
I hope you can get some satisfaction, I feel for you mate when you buy a new one it should be perfect.
rob h
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Re: LML two year warranty

Postby Quasi » Fri Apr 29, 2016 3:49 pm

I do thank you for your advice on the legal issues. The warranty manager at MOTO GB said after some discussion including saying they would rather look after the dealer than a customer, I guess its probably in case they lose a toehold in the local market place in my area. Adding if I get an estimate for repaint and its reasonable they may well approve it.
I am in no rush as I want the scooter looked at in the dry sunny weather so faults can be really inspected. April is a mixed bag of showers so getting to the paint shop dry is critical. I make no bones about it I will bang them and the dealership into court if I have to.
Its the old saying '"give enough rope and they will hang themselves". So slowly slowly catch the monkey
Quasi.
Quasi
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Location: Great Yarmouth area
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Re: LML two year warranty

Postby Lusciousthelock » Fri Apr 29, 2016 7:37 pm

When I ordered my new "Last Run" the dealer did explain that some of them can occasionally be a "bit rough". He recently sent a couple back arriving with dents. I guess it depends on how rough is rough. All we seem to read on here is about broken speedo cables and sticky throttles. It does imply that quality control is lacking but having researched these faults, it's kinda what I wanted. It's a project machine for me rather than my main commuter but I'm more of an oily rag type of person than pristine show and shine.

I was also alerted to the fact that these are tinkerer's and enthusiasts machines and should be treated as such. If I paid PX money I would expect more, but I didn't so I expect a little bit of work upon arrival. How was your's sold to you?
Who need's brakes? They only slow you down!
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Re: LML two year warranty

Postby Quasi » Fri Apr 29, 2016 9:20 pm

Hello Lusciousthelock. In reply, mine was sold in the best Submarine Talk by the sales rep, "Run Deep, Run Silent". Sure I asked all the right Qs and As, this is not the first new vehicle (Cars and Bikes) I have purchased. My last two scooters were 50 years ago, 1 a 4 year old Vespa V5 GS150 and the other A new Vespa MK2 GS 160 which I kept for Couple of years until getting a car, yep we Mods of that era grew up. So I can say the first GS 150was nightmare of electrical faults. The MK2 160 was a dream throughout my ownership, regret ever selling it but thats life. So back to the LML. I read all the guff, read through this forum, made the descion and went for this 4T/200. The saleman was very a laidback biker. He said you cannot take notice of forums, but I said that it gives the buyer an idea of any pros and cons. I think the scooter is OK, its just the fact that it should be of durable quality and fit for purpose. LML India have with their scooters a good product but to be a world leader they need to ensure their machines have a final build quality assembly line inspection. I have worked in both the Luton Vauxhall and Austin Rover car plants on line assembly so products leaving the line should be OK and dealers normally sort warranty issues. LML cannot IMHO rave on about a two year warranty, or dealers duck out of explaining openly and honestly any small print clauses. The former is misleading in their advertising, the latter is plain dishonest withholding vital customer information in their selling of LML products especially as I mentioned that its the two warranty that I liked for peace of mind.
I understand your drift of the oily rag tinkering, I am sure that will come, but at the moment I just want to enjoy it, fuss over it and give the weekend polish up with all the chrome gear that I have put on it. Its for leisure and pleasure. It was not a case of Vespa being dearer or anything like that, it was that I have seen loads of LML around and they look and go very well. I expect mechanical teething problems but not shoddy body work and faulty paint.
Regards Quasi.
Quasimodo is my life long nickname given to me by my friends and work colleagues for as long as I can remember, Why? Simple, if things are not up to the correct standard I get the hump and sort it. Nicely but firmly.
Quasi
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Location: Great Yarmouth area
Scooter: Lml 4t 200

Re: LML two year warranty

Postby Lusciousthelock » Sat Apr 30, 2016 8:27 am

I'll admit that when describing how my machine was sold to me I was regarding my own 2t rather than the flagship model 200 which should really be top notch by today's standards but there are other clues to the quality. Our general scooter design is getting on for nearly forty years old and yet we still get the same defects reported over and over. You would think by now it should be a solid, well sorted machine!

What do your paint defects look like? Obviously you would want them fixed but would somebody like me notice? I can see well enough, but even with glasses, cannot determine detail. I could not tell the difference between the quality of the new 4k HD tv the wife wanted and our old CRT one sat next to it. I would notice a scratch or dent though, but possibly not a dull bit of paint.

I had a bad dealer experience with my last 7k big bike about three years ago, where it would blow it's electric's every time it rained. I was told by the dealer that modern commuter bikes were not really designed to be ridden in the rain. It was off the road for nearly ten weeks until the parts came in and was a constant battle to get fixed under warranty at three months old! After that we decided to ignore the warranties, I loved the bike and could service it myself and all that was really required was to pump grease into the rear brake switch. Save some money rather than pay out to someone to protect that warranty that doesn't really exist. They only want to take your money and run. In reality the legal side cannot be that cut and dry as so many big dealerships seem to have the same policies. When I eventually pick up my scoot- please be this week :D I shall check as best I can before accepting but do really feel it's all up to me once I've left the building.
Who need's brakes? They only slow you down!
Lusciousthelock
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Location: Medway Towns (Twydall) Kent.
Scooter: LML 2t 2016 Milano Red

Re: LML two year warranty

Postby Quasi » Sat Apr 30, 2016 12:36 pm

Hello again. Re the paint problems. The scooter is that dark metallic red. However In bright sunlight the bike shines brilliantly but in my garage light which is obviously shaded somewhat the front nearside panel and bang in centre of that is a large area of paint that seems to have had some fluid spilt on it and then it has been sprayed over. This mark runs for about 8" or so. As I say it bright light the reflection blurs it out. Above the mark there is a scuffing as if somebody has had a go at T-cutting the blemish and have left fine surface scratch lines. The other paint faults are around the seat line where the side panels attach. This looks like somebody has over brushed like a glue or solvent on the tub that houses the tank and seat. Again it would seem they just sprayed over the tub area. As I look around in a more critical mode I can see minor imperfection that I could live with. What amazed me is the dealer has another new LML 4T/125 with a crease in the front near side legshield. I am sure that a dent removal person could remove it but the dealer is selling it as is. Again as it the dark blue metallic it does not readily show up unless you get the scooter at the right angle of view. It really is annoying that whatever make of machine the dealers can just thumbs their nose up at customers and the Consumer Rights legislation.
Oh dear I am back on my soapbox. Sorry I don't mean to, but it does make me angry. The "that will do" attitude just will not wash for me.
So when you get your scooter walk around it looking from various angles. Oh by the way you do not get a service book or anything like. It is all done on the dealers computer system with LML at MotoGB. I have downloaded the workshop manual to my laptop for future reference.
Regards Quasi.
Quasi
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Posts: 6
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Location: Great Yarmouth area
Scooter: Lml 4t 200

Re: LML two year warranty

Postby nige b » Sun May 01, 2016 1:58 pm

if delers are sending scooters back because of damage, moto gb are not doing much apart from deliver for their money
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